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Messages - binggo

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1
投票权 这个都还好,改改规则的事。

现在的锁喂价和高延迟喂价 都是不理想的。

能够保持锚定的同时还能够保证供应量 才是关键,
在喂价不低于外盘价格的前提下,能否根据bitcny 溢价/贬值 来调整喂价,
比如bitcny贬值5-10%, 那么喂价下调 直到跟外盘价格一样,
如果bitcny溢价5-10%   那么喂价就上调,溢价5%就上调5%, 溢价10%就上调10%(是否需要设置一个上限?)
如果bitcny处于锚定状态,那么就不进行调整喂价。跟着外盘走。

这个只是大概意思和想法,大佬们推演一下可行性和期间利弊!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

个人觉得肯定比锁喂价和高延迟喂价好。。。即使外盘价格0.18  内盘价格0.22 只要bitcny处于锚定状态 也就无所谓了。内盘 外盘会互相影响。而不是以前只是外盘影响内盘。

AEX下架bitcny之前,如果能保证供应量和锚定,或许就不会被下架。锚定币里面也会有bitcny的一席之地。


第一个问题:

投票权不是那么好改,就好比与狐谋皮,狐狸会愿意吗?

第二个问题:

你这个方案其实就是BSIP42....BSIP42你应该是有印象的...

bitcny的相对锚定存在两个条件:

1.喂价准确;

2.足额的抵押;

3.足够小的MSSR。

只要喂价相对准确,MSSR足够小,基本不会出现的bitcny升值的情况(当然不是绝对,特定情况下还有供应量的问题),所以升值的问题不会太大。

至于贬值,强清虽然不是一个好东西,但是在抑制贬值方面还是可以的,只要设置合适的补偿在5%,就可以抑制住贬值,不超过5%的贬值问题不大。

喂价不准确,是锚不住的,必然条件...只要内外盘价格存在差,就会有汇率差

--------------


你想能够保持锚定的同时还能够保证供应量,在喂价上能够做的文章极其有限,也解决不了,但是可以从其它方面入手, 前提条件是喂价正常:

1. P2P借贷:在一定抵押率内的抵押仓位可以通过借贷不被平仓,比如MCR=1.75,1.2-1.75范围内的抵押仓位可以通过P2P借贷来保证自己的仓位不被平掉。
这样很多仓位在暴跌的时候,并不会抽走大量的锚定资产。

这种P2P借贷是指无需抵押物的无风险借贷,只需要按时交息即可,

2. 设置黑天鹅池:所有资不低债的债仓全部没收至黑天鹅池,黑天鹅池的债仓由系统在锚定资产区的收入慢慢进行消化,黑天鹅池永不爆仓。
     只要喂价正常,可以正常抵押,即使黑天鹅池资不抵债,市场也会很神奇的锚住....因为有持续收入来做信用抵押...

3.  引入大币: btc,eth, 一个稳定币想要在市场中活下来,不引入大币是不可能的,单靠自己,连小而美都做不到。

这3个方面就可以在喂价正常的情况下保证锚定与供应量,但是想要实现,我估计几年之内是不可能的。

第一个功能,很多合约交易所相似的功能已经实现,像Bitmex, 币安,OK等都有保险金池;

第二个功能,像维基,MOV等类似的功能也已实现;

第三个功能,只要做defi的,没有不引入大币的,bts除外。

所以,不是不给机会,是整个bts社区太煞笔化,只知道作弊与菠菜,社区互割互薅。

至于喂价,暴跌的时候把喂价下降的速度缓冲下来即可,但是这个缓冲时间至多不能超过1-2个小时,这是喂价能够改良的极限。

最好是开新帖子说这个事...

BTS的问题都是可以复盘的,很多人懒的复盘罢了,一个正常化的锚定市场对谁都有好处,喂价不正常,强清补偿不正常,全部都受伤害,当然可能除了能够薅羊毛降低成本的。

2
General Discussion / Re: Liquidity Mining(main thread)
« on: July 11, 2020, 08:54:23 am »

There's always dogs shouting and biting in this world, hope they enjoy.

OK now let's discuss the "code is law" concept seriously, with the "1.14.200  BTS repurchase destruction proposal" as an example, to see what a governance structure the BTS code has built.

in current committee, the committee members that agree to execute 1.14.200 hold less than 50% voting power, not possible to execute it.

I am one of the committee members that is against 1.14.200, I respect the opinion of the stakeholders but I don't think a committee member is just a puppet to follow the stakeholders' opinion.

if stakeholders think the 1.14.200 is so important, please vote to replace the committee members to ensure it be executed.

so in the parameter management and committee-controlled funds management area, the execution of one proposal need not only enough voting power in poll voting, but also need enough consensus in the committee.

this is what the BTS code determine.



So, you are the dog which stole the money from the house, now the dog become the master of the BTS holders, BTS holders become the dog, interesting!

Is it right?

@alt  谁是狗?谁是主人?

“我从未见过有如此厚颜无耻之人!!!”

能把强词夺理,治理漏洞说得如此清新脱俗,鲜廉寡耻,巨蟹你也算是一号人物了。

大股东与核心开发既然都甘愿做狗,甘愿吃屎,连底裤都不想维护,那我们也没有意见了,吃吧,吃吧,祝你们吃的开心!

这真是BTS治理历程浓墨的一笔呢

怪不得 btsnow不愿意将资金退回来,人家早看清人没有底线是什么样子。

既然说的都这么露骨了,社区投票对理事来说可有可无,社区在理事账户的资金是理事会的小金库,社区没有决定权,那还狗里狗气搞什么投票呢?给自己脸上贴金?你们随心所欲的花就是了,上一次MM不就是这样吗?是不是 @abit?!


如果各个票仓持有人都不愿维护社区残剩的这么一点底裤,那也就无所谓了。




3
General Discussion / Re: Ordering Mining(main thread)
« on: July 10, 2020, 03:15:48 pm »

actually I am tired in replying these kind of words, perhaps this is the last time for me to reply.

in public chain code is law, specially in BTS which means stakeholders decide who are committee members and committee members do the defined governance  work with reference to the stakeholders' opinion.

here the "defined governance" include the management of system parameters and the committee controlled funds.
I have said several times, Committee is just like the Board of a company.

BAIP fit this case enough, and opposition faction are given enough time to get enough voting power.

You said, not the community said!

Not to obey the WPS, just want to steal the money from the committee-account, this is you!

Destroyed the chain is what you do and like.

When you said code is law, 你就老阴阳人了,正儿八经的销毁提案就在那放着着,按照你们的逻辑,你们怎么不执行?!玩双标很开心?!

能不能给国人在区块链上多少留点脸面?

从资金池正大光明的捞钱不行?非要绕着弯的从理事会账号捞?你们是真当社区都是煞笔吗?!

年年一套套的传销忽悠逻辑还在忽悠一帮煞笔韭菜吗?!能把你自己忽悠信吗?嗯,可能真把自己忽悠信了!




4
the approved proposal include payment to development and daily operation:

You inform or not inform is not important, the important thing is you broke the baseline of WPS and you didn't admit it, you guys spent and steal the community property from the committeee-account as your explanation and wish,instead of the WPS.

When other workers obey the baseline of WPS, you guys gave another explanation to manipulate the committeee-account for getting the money, this had broke the chain, oh, you maybe undertand it or pretend not understanding it,as it is not important to you,how to grab the money is the most important thing for you.


When a chain didn‘t have the baseline anymore,then it will collapse very soon.

“上行下效;淫俗将成;败国乱人;实由兹起。”

“梁亡。此未有伐者。其言梁亡何?自亡也。其自亡奈何?鱼烂而亡也。”
 


5
Here it starts bitcrab making first proposal 1.10.59522 to send 150k BTS from committee account to vianull .

Of course not informing about it in public committee chat because why his chinese comrades are going to approve it without informing anybody about it outside of their small group.

Perfect!

If can i think that any workers can get the fund from the committee-account not from the reserve pool? that's wonderful for everyone and community!

From now, the committee become our god and lord, i like it.


6
中文(Chinese) / Re: 投票权的重新设计
« on: July 10, 2020, 02:18:26 am »
对于提案裁决,一个提案有支持与反对两个选项,即使条件是:支持票数大于比如 2/3*(支持票+反对票),也会产生投票安全性比较低的问题,会使在总流通性占比比较少的票仓作弊获利,比如占总流通不到17%的票仓就可以决定一个提案,所以需要一个界限,提高投票安全性。

专门拿BTS来说,比如设置一个长期有效的反对提案,此反对提案对所有提案均有效,但是这种反对提案,利益挂钩太少,所以现在的refund 提案很大程度上就可以用来做这种反对提案,但是refund提案也可以被票仓转移作弊,所以还需要一个硬性不受影响的阈值,这个阈值的意义就相当于BTC当初在实行隔离见证的时候需要超过51%的算力支持,而不是不到20%的算力支持。

也就是一个决议提案通过需要:支持票数 大于 2/3*(支持票+反对票),并能够持续领取满额工资,投票硬性阈值=20%*总流通量,长期有效的通用反对提案或者设计单一提案中有支持/反对两个选项。

这样一个决议提案通过需要3个门槛:

1. 支持票数大于 2/3 *(支持票+反对票);

2. 可以持续领取满额工资;

3. 超过投票硬性阈值。

任何提案门槛通过后的判定生效时间不得低于7天。

7
General Discussion / Re: Ordering Mining(main thread)
« on: July 09, 2020, 11:26:33 pm »

worker proposal fit the case that need automatically transfer funds from reserve pool to applicant's account, not the usage of committee managed funds.

committee has the power to manage  committee-controlled parameters and use committee managed funds, based on necessary voting.


So interesting words!

Committee didn't have the power to manage the committee parameters and funds, just help, only can follow the decision of the community.

Quote
necessary voting

Oh, a cheating vote, is it? @abit

How necessary? necessary or not necessary, just decided by your mouth, not by the community.

We will see which committees will help other to steal the money of communtiy from the committee-account, this will be a hallmark event for BTS governance,congratulates?why not?!

maybe them?

@bitcrab
@zhouxiaobao-2010
@abit
@jademont
@kang8
@btsai



OK, more interesting things!

committee-trade

THRESHOLD=3
   
abit           1   
agorise   1   
bhuz   1   
btsai   1   
clockwork 1   
zhouxiaobao-2010 1

8
BAIP-Threshold and threshold-bsip didn't have any PR/MD for community, if these things and vote threshold were not important for community?

BAIP-Threshold and threshold-bsip didn't obey the cornerstone of WPS, a worker need to get the full pay from the reserve pool to make it was actived, but these threshold destroyed the baseline.

Even these threshold were created by committee-account, but it still need to keep its availability through getting full pay from the reserve pool, not through the mouth.

Now these threshold can't keep its availability and didn't get the approval from the community, but someone said it is actived?!

A threshold's design can be easily cheated by cn-vote or others big vote, e.g. BAIP6, cn-vote and other big vote can easily steal the money from the committee-account through this cheating threshold, so is it right for a threshold?

cn-vote and other big vote and committees support refund400k to stop any workers to get the pay from the reserve pool, now they make these threshold steal money from the committee-account not reserve pool, how ridiculous!

If you vote these threshold, then you fell into the trap made by them, as these threshold didn't follow the baseline of WPS, just follow their mouths!


As a bts holder,ask yourself,is it right?!

As a bts committee,ask yourself,is it right?!


9
中文(Chinese) / Re: BAIP6投票操作一赏
« on: July 07, 2020, 08:00:44 am »
btsai被禁言了,又来这里,你智商堪忧啊,人家自己的票,怎么投,关你屁事,你有逼本事,投票反对啊

btsai我要求删号的,你有意见吗?!

怎么投,自然有基本的WPS原则,所以践踏原则的时候,对你来说,自然是不关屁事。

所以,你是属于被喂粑粑喊香的那个人吗?

再者,这跟他娘的反对与不反对有个毛的关系,你智商在线吗?能看明白吗?哦, sorry,对不起,你似乎看不明白

10
中文(Chinese) / Re: BAIP6投票操作一赏
« on: July 07, 2020, 04:36:48 am »
@bitcrab
@zhouxiaobao-2010
@abit
@jademont
@kang8
@btsai

有些憨憨的理事可以解释与理解一下:

国内的聪明理事们也可以尝试对这个发表一下作为理事与核心开发的看法:

BAIP-THRESHOLD怎么就莫名其妙的成为一个标准了呢?连PR\MD都没有,激活程序都没有,难道嘴上说是就是了?为什么理事们个个对此沉默寡言,不出一声呢?!!

BSIP-THRESHOLD也一样呢,莫名其妙的就成为一个标准了呢!

几个人说是就是,不投还不行了呢,妙啊,这个把戏玩的妙啊,投了是煞笔,不投也是煞笔,怎么解释全靠几个人一张嘴呢,那是否可以定义一下社区是不是SB呢?

就像一坨粑粑硬塞到社区嘴里,可还合各位口味?

我想了解一下WPS的基本原则呢!

如果都可以这样玩的话,什么样的投票规则都白瞎呢!

俗话说:白道有白道的规矩,黑道有黑道的道义,那这些蒙着头执行BAIP6的理事们是什么道?认为BAIP6比BAIP-THRESHOLD高就认为是激活的是什么道?

国内理事们,你们很骚气啊!

我想投票阈值最基本的一个原则是防操控与保证基础投票率,但是这个BSIP/BAIP阈值设计骚气的很呢。

11
中文(Chinese) / 见证人机制的重新设计
« on: July 07, 2020, 12:01:47 am »
像DPOS这种见证人机制,可能需要向“票选见证人+抵押见证人”的方向改进。

票选见证人就是指现在的这种体系;
像票选见证人很大程度上要靠投票体系来做纠偏监督,然而事实大家也看到了,一面趋向于中心化控制,一面趋向于BTS持有人对这部分并不是那么关心,纠偏效率相当低。
而且这种机制温水煮青蛙,会导致备选见证人体系随时间逐渐崩溃,21个见证人这种数量很容易被国际突袭搞瘫或者交易所联合做局(比如steem)夺取控制权。

抵押见证人指的是要抵押一部分BTS就可以成为BTS的见证人进行参与出块,这些抵押的bts没有投票权,不受票仓控制,监督纠偏由代码执行,作弊会导致:见证人临时下线-超过阈值-押金比例惩罚。

要实现抵押见证人就需要:

1. 降低大众进入门槛。

这样可以使DPOS最大可能的去中心化,增强鲁棒性。
------------------------------


我们可以把DPOS的101位见证人位置看做是101个缆车,其中21个缆车是票选缆车,每个票选缆车只有一个座位容纳一个见证人,而剩余的80个缆车是抵押缆车,每个抵押缆车有三个座位可容纳三个见证人。

抵押缆车会随机安排进三个抵押见证人到每轮出块排队序列,这三个抵押见证人在这个抵押缆车进行打包出块的时候按随机数从这三个抵押见证人中随机选择作为出块人,出块收益按照8:1:1进行分配。

出块人作恶会被临时下线,超过阈值扣除抵押金。

见证人的收益可以为:

1.固定出块奖励;
2.其打包块所包含处理费的比如30%.
3.扣除的抵押金。

21位票选见证人代替理事位置,这样票选见证人所获收益会大于抵押见证人,间接作为其作为理事会成员的激励。

------------------------------------

ETH2.0中设定是质押32个eth才会激活,所以按照价格换算过来可以质押32万个bts才会激活。

当然再增加攻击成本的话就是抵押缆车座位增加到6,或者质押金提高至50万bts,假如101见证位置都满员的话。

现在见证人一年支出为10512000.0bts, 单见证人年收入在500571.0bts。

如果101见证人排满大概每个缆车一年收入在104079.0bts, 摊到个人的话在34693.0bts.

运行维护一个节点我们算它是年支出为8万左右,需要币价上涨至2.3左右,如果币价不涨的话,需要每块奖励为5个bts在现在这个价位[思考],见证人一年总支出为5千万bts...

我们拿现在一个块有10笔交易,每笔处理费0.04826 BTS ,一个块总计0.4825bts处理费,分30%是0.14475 bts,一年7万多bts.

-----------------------------------------------


当然是否也可以是抵押见证人staking模式:

这种形式的见证人需要抵押比如50万bts作为预备见证人,然后普通用户可以把自己的bts投票(只能一票一投)给预备见证人做staking,当达到最大投票值(比如800万bts)后见证人才能激活。

每个抵押见证缆车还是三个位置。

已投票给票选见证人的无法投票给抵押见证人staking,staing的投票无法投票票选见证人。




12
中文(Chinese) / 投票权的重新设计
« on: July 06, 2020, 10:03:50 am »
现在BTS存在严重的锚定资产抵押票权问题:

在有全局清算的情况下,这个问题不会太严重,但是在有了黑天鹅保护及锁喂价机制情况下,这种问题开始恶化。

1.黑天鹅保护机制:这种机制导致很多债仓在事实资不抵债的情况下,还拥有大量票权,这种资不抵债的虚假票权数量还相当庞大;

2.锁喂价机制:当真实价格远低于锁定喂价时,很多债仓事实已经开始资不抵债,也就是说他们还拥有规模庞大的虚假票权。

这些规模庞大的资不抵债的抵押者会利用这种虚假票权通过一些有利于自身而对系统有害的提案,喂价锁定,作弊提案BAIP6等等诸如此类。

而且在价格不断上升过程中,这种锚定资产抵押票权会指数型上升,从而可以轻松掌握大部分话语权,控制见证人、理事会,进而威胁到整个系统的安全与产品。

这已经伤害到了BTS作为核心代币与投票代币的基础,BTS真正的长期持有者会越来越丧失话语权,导致社区越来越离心,进而导致BTS不再是一个去中心化治理的区块链体系,而是一个可以随时被自己产品机制绑架的中心化利益产物,在市场中也很难去赢得信誉与信任。

所以,修正BTS投票制度迫在眉睫:

我的想法是这样的:

1. 设置投票池:只有锁定到投票池的BTS才能获得全部投票权;

2. 如果投票者想要从投票池中提出一定数量的BTS,则需要90天的解冻期,解冻期的BTS没有投票权,剩余投票权=锁定的BTS-要解冻的BTS;

3. 投票操作消耗币天数:每次投票操作都会消耗10%的总币天数,总币天数=30天币天数,最大可获得币天数=30天币天数。

4. 锁定在投票池的BTS可以获得系统奖励。

5. 不在投票池的无抵押的BTS投票权只有:投票池BTS数量/BTS总流通量。

6. 抵押物票权:(抵押数量-抵押物数量/CR)* (投票池BTS数量/BTS总流通量),严格意义上来讲,我不建议有抵押物票权,太容易绑架系统,尤其对bts而言。


或者:

1. 设置投票池:只有锁定到投票池的BTS才能获得全部投票权;

2. 如果投票者想要从投票池中提出一定数量的BTS,则需要比如7天的解冻期,解冻期的BTS没有投票权,剩余投票权=锁定的BTS-要解冻的BTS;

或者直接不需要解冻期,因为2与3某种程度上相冲突,交易所或者大票仓想要搞突然袭击,会先要锁定到投票池获得足够的币天数做准备,这个准备时间足够做预警通知,当然交易所提前锁到里面谁也没有办法,愿打愿挨都是存款在交易所的持有人的权力。
短解冻期,投票的积极性也容易调动。

3. 投票池投票操作需要消耗币天数:每次投票操作都会消耗10%的总币天数,总币天数=30天币天数,最大可获得币天数=30天币天数。

4. 锁定在投票池的BTS可以获得系统奖励。

如果没有解冻期或者解冻期很短的话,这个奖励可能就是形式性质,不需要支出太多。

5. 不在投票池的无抵押的BTS投票权只有:投票池BTS数量/BTS总流通量。或者加一个系数比如1.1*投票池BTS数量/BTS总流通量 做平衡。

6. 抵押物票权:(抵押数量-抵押物数量/CR)* (投票池BTS数量/BTS总流通量),严格意义上来讲,我不建议有抵押物票权,太容易绑架系统,尤其对bts而言。


-----------

投票死亡问题,的确需要投票随时间衰减。

13
If BTS community and bts holders think this cheating vote and threshold is reasonable and can be acceptable,

then this is the shame for bts holders and committee.

You want BTS to become like this? everything is cheating? as you wish.

14
General Discussion / vote of non-confidence to committee
« on: July 04, 2020, 03:44:01 pm »
Vote of non-confidence to these committees

bitcrab
zhouxiaobao-2010
abit
liondani
evangelist-of-bts
jademont
bhuz
kang8
btsai

1.no activity;

2.no base line;

3.harm the property of community.

4.Can't guide the community to the right direction.


If you want BTS go to die, chose them.

15

Pure delusion to expect a fraction of historic volunteerism when the committee scammed tens of thousands of users via bitassets.

If we could see tomorrow, what of your plans?
No one can live in sorrow, ask all your friends
Times that you took in stride, they're back in demand
I was the one who was washing blood off your hands

Don't you cry tonight
I still love you, baby
Don't you cry tonight
Don't you cry tonight
There's a heaven above you baby
And don't you cry tonight

I know the things you wanted, they're not what you have
With all the people talking, it's driving you mad
If I was standing by you, how would you feel
Knowing your love's decided, and all love is real?

 (C) 1991 Guns N' Roses - Don't Cry
https://youtu.be/zRIbf6JqkNc



You say you want a revolution
Well, you know
We all want to change the world
You tell me that it's evolution
Well, you know
We all want to change the world
But when you talk about destruction
Don't you know that you can count me out
Don't you know it's gonna be all right
all right, all right

You say you got a real solution
Well, you know
We'd all love to see the plan
You ask me for a contribution
Well, you know
We're doing what we can
But when you want money
for people with minds that hate
All I can tell is brother you have to wait
Don't you know it's gonna be all right
all right, all right

Ah
ah, ah, ah, ah, ah...

You say you'll change the constitution
Well, you know
We all want to change your head
You tell me it's the institution
Well, you know
You better free you mind instead
But if you go carrying pictures of chairman Mao
You ain't going to make it with anyone anyhow
Don't you know it's gonna be all right

all right, all right
all right, all right, all right
all right, all right, all right

(C) 1968 The Beatles - Revolution
https://youtu.be/BGLGzRXY5Bw

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